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Laggar Falcon (Falco jugger) -
Stemmer kan høres her (eksternt link)
Lokalitet:
Rajastan - Indien
2008-02-15
Fotograf: Christian Andersen Jensen - Se profil

Uploadet 2008-02-15 Publiceret 2008-02-15 Falco jugger Laggar Falcon
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Kommentarer
Mattias Nordlund
17. feb. 2008 kl. 06:18
I think you may need to change the name to laggar falcon on this one. Prob. a 2cy bird. The bird seems to have the deep dark brown pattern of imm. laggar. On photo of 1 cy laggar; http://www.orientalbirdimages.org/birdimages.php?p=13&action=birdspecies&Bird_ID=1066&Bird_Family_ID=110&pagesize=1 Kind regards/Mattias
Mattias Nordlund
17. feb. 2008 kl. 13:56
I´m sorry for the confusion. I did not think of the leg collour (but are they blue-grey on the picture?, maybe, you have seen the bird so you are surely right). As you say the bird looks rather heavy (but i think the laggar can look as heavy as this). I´m a bit on thin ice there. I thought that only imm. laggar had this overfull allmost all-brown belly. As in this photo; http://www.orientalbirdimages.org/search.php?p=14&action=searchresult&Bird_ID=1066&Bird_Family_ID=&pagesize=1 I cannot say more about the id. for me the allmost all-brown belly told me laggar. (But i´d realised that imm. saker can look allmost similar, but i think it´s rare with this belly colour on saker) Hope some one with more experience can clear things out ;-) /Mattias
Ole Krogh
28. nov. 2008 kl. 12:33
Det må være en Laggarfalk. Fuglen er 2k og burde have (rufous) orangebrune fjerkanter på oversiden og svt halemønster med tværstribning. Fuglen ser simpelthen for mørk ud og uden orangebrune strøg på hoved og iøvrigt hele kroppen til at kunne være Slagfalk. The bird must be a 2cy Lagger falcon. A Saker must have rufous feather-fringes to upperparts and tail-pattern. It is simply too dark to be a Saker. //Ole
Peter Sunesen
28. nov. 2008 kl. 13:46
Before changing the (correct?) id. of this bird I would like to hear an expert chime in. Saker can be as dark and the photo shows heavy bill and correct wing/tail ratio for Saker, Laggar being shorter-tailed(see recent photo of adult Laggar on on this site)with a finer bill. When Ole says that Saker must have roufous fringes he is at a variance with Dick Forsman who writes:"....first-winter birds look uniformly greyish brown above as early as late autumn, thus being similar to juvenile Lanners." Regards Peter
Klaus Malling Olsen
28. nov. 2008 kl. 14:30
Fuglen må være en ung Laggarfalk. Antager vi, at Forsmans udsagn er korrekt, er der stadig flere andre karakterer at gå op. At bedømme præcis størrelse på en fugl 8over eller under 50 cm.) er vanskeligt. Laggarfalk er lidt mindre end Slagfalk, men den er fortsat en reel storfalk. Laggarfalk blev tidligere regnet som race af Lannerfalk - og en rent størrelses- og jizzmæssigt tæt på denne. Fuglen har meget mørkt ansigt, da mørk tøjle, øjenbryn og skæg flyder sammen. Hos Slagfalk er tøjlen ofte lys, hvilket sammen med bredt lyst felt omkring øjet gør, at mørke øjen- og skægstriber står tydelige ud, isoleret fra det mørke øje. Jeg har ikke set fotos af Slagfalke med så mørkt ansigt som denne - men derimod flere Laggarfalke (f.eks. i Rishad Naoroji´s fremragende "Birds of prey of the Indian Subcontinent). Desudn er oversiden endog meget mørkt brun, ligesom flankerne og bugen virker endnu mere massivt mørke end hos Slagfalk. Endeligt synes vingerne at gålidt for langt ud mod halespidsen (bør nok slutte længere inde på halen hos en typsik Slagfalk). This looks as young Laggar Falcon. Until recently, Laggar was treated as a ssp. of Lanner Falcon, with which it shares jizz and size. The loral areas in this bird is completely dark, melting into moustacial and eye-streak. In saker, lores are paler (or at least not as massive dark as here) and the surrounding of the eye paler,creating isolated dark eye, moustche and eje-streak. Although certain very dark Sakers may show as uniform and very dark upperparts as this birds, most shows some paler feather-edges. Also, the dark flank feathers are almost unpatterned dark, whereas Sakes often shows a few pale spots. also, the rather slender shape and the - compared to typical sakers - slightly longer wing projection, points toward Laggar Falcon.
Ole Krogh
28. nov. 2008 kl. 14:40
Mine tilføjende kommentarer skrevet inden/samtidig/krydset med ´glimrende kommentarer fra Klaus Efter hvad jeg kan se, tyder den meget mørke bug på Laggar. På de billeder jeg har set af Saker, er bugen lysere og mere stribet. Citat Forsman juvenile s534: "Upper parts uniformly dark brown with distinct narrow margins to each feather. During winter, margins bleach and gradually wear off". S538 ses en juvenile escaped at have orangebrune fjerkanter i februar måned. Og Forsman skriver her: "uniform rufous fringes to upperparts typical of juvenile". Plate 570 ses en 2k febr fugl, som også er meget lysere og med mere orange istrøg end, hvad der er på den her afbildede fugl. Alle/de fleste billeder af Slagfalk (også adulte) i Forsman viser lyse fjerkanter på overside. Hvis den afbillede fugl skulle være Slagfalk ville det og så være bedst med lys halespids. Den kan selvfølgelig være slidt af mere eller mindre. Næb, synes jeg, kan passe på såvel Laggar- som Slagfalk. // Ole
Peter Sunesen
28. nov. 2008 kl. 20:53
No matter how Ole reads Dick Forsman, it is a fact that plate 668 on page 538 shows two of three fresh juveniles with an almost uniformly dark upperside with only narrow or no rofous fringes. By feb.- when the discussed photo was taken- abrasion will have had even greater impact, so the written comment by Dick Forsman on page 532 that I quoted in my comment above is still not only logical, but also obviously true. To Klaus: I do think that plate 668 shows that the lores can be dark in Saker as well. Nice to read your comments though. I still think the jizz is more akin to the larger Saker, and the plumage alone does not convince me entirely to favour Laggar, but with a knowledgeable guy like KMO arguing for Laggar its hard not to waver. Thank you Peter
Ole Krogh
28. nov. 2008 kl. 23:06
Hi Peter, I agree with Klaus about this bird. I am only making citat from Forsman. It is not my words. In fact Klaus and I saw many Laggar Falcons two years ago in Gujarat and Rajasthan on a memorable three- week tour. So a little bit of experiance we have and I cannot remember any Saker Falcon from the area. But a good little discussion on a thread from february, which was not finished at that time and obviously not now !?. Best wishes, Ole
Rune Sø Neergaard
30. nov. 2008 kl. 04:00
Fuglen er hermed omdøbt til Laggarfalk. Mvh RSN/admin

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